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MatPlus.Net Forum Competitions Udo-Degener 50 JT
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(1) Posted by Torsten Linß [Sunday, Dec 27, 2009 23:49]; edited by Torsten Linß [09-12-27]

Udo-Degener 50 JT

Udo Degener recently celebrated (?) his 50th birthday. On this occasion harmonie announces a jubilee tourney for problems of any length, but longer than two moves, showing typical two mover themes. There will be two categories:
(a) orthodox problems (judged by Udo Degener)
(b) fairy ches problems (judged jointly by Udo Degener and Torsten Linß)
Entries to Frank Richter (Ahrenshäger Straße 20, D-18320 Trinwillershagen, Germany; email:
Closing date: 23 November 2010
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(2) Posted by Miodrag Mladenović [Monday, Dec 28, 2009 13:48]

Here is an example showing required theme:

Milan Velimirović
Dedicated to Udo Degener
Spec. Pr. Mat Plus 1995
(= 11+10 )


1...Kxe6 2.Sxd3 ~ 3.Rxc6/Rxg6#
1...Kd4 2.Rc3 ~ 3.Rxd3#
2...Rd~(x) 2.Qf6#(A)
2...dxe4(y) 2.Qd6#(B)
2...fxe4(z) 2.Qe5#(C)
1...Kf4 2.Rg3 ~ 3.Sxd3#
2...Rd~(x) 2.Qd6#(B)
2...dxe4(y) 2.Qe5#(C)
2...fxe4(z) 2.Qf6#(A)

Lacny theme. Milan avoided twin position in twomover by adding nice keymove in threemover. Very nice problem.
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(3) Posted by Jean-Marc Loustau [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 09:57]

In the last issue of MPR, there is also an important article by D Stojnic about Durasevic theme in orthodox 3# (Gockel form), with many excellent problems showing of course the required theme.
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(4) Posted by Miodrag Mladenović [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 13:05]; edited by Miodrag Mladenović [09-12-29]

Another good example:

Slobodan Mladenović
Die Schwalbe 1989
2. Platz
(= 11+10 )


1.Kd7! zz
1...bxc5 2.Qxc6 [3.Sg4#(A)] Kf6(x) 3.Rxf5#(B)
1...Bc7 2.Rxe7 [3.Rxf5#(B)] Kf6(x) 3.Bg7#(C)
1...g4 2.Qf1 [3.Bg7#(C)] Kf6(x) 3.Sg4#(A)
1...Bf7 2.Rxf7 ~ 3.Sg6#
1...Bxh7 2.Qa2 ~ 3.Qxe6/Sg4#
1...Kf6 2.Bg5+ Ke5 3.Sg6#

Ukrainian Cycle (Cycle Le-Grand). This is known mechanism from the ortodox twomover, however I think it's a better problem as threemover. One flaw of Ukrainian cycle in #2 is lack of variations. Here in #3 there are at least three variations or threat and two variations.
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(5) Posted by Milan Velimirović (+) [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 15:27]

There are several ways to apply a twomover theme/pattern in a threemover, two of which are to my opinion the most interesting. One is a twin-emulation where each (thematic) black defence leads to a two-move problem (often 'solved' by a checking key). Another is the one which, I think, offers more fun: shift of thematic roles half a move up, i.e. white second move in a #3 assumes the function/position of a black defence in a #2, while black second move of a #3 assumes the function of the mate in a #2. Of course, the latter (probably not thematic for this tourney) can also be realized by shift of thematic roles in the other direction - half a move down.

The following problem illustrates both methods I'm talking about:

Milan Velimirovic, Die Schwalbe 1976
(= 9+8 )
1.Be6! ~/Qxg1 2.f6+

1...Qh5 2.Sd2+ C Ke3,Ke5 3.Sf1,Re4#
    2.Sb2+? A Ke3! a
    2.Sxd6+? B Ke5! b

1...Qh4 2.Sb2+ A Ke3,Ke5 3.Sd1,Sxd3#
    2.Sxd6+? B Ke3! a
    2.Sd2+? C Ke5! b

1...Qh3 2.Sxd6+ B Ke3,Ke5 3.Re4,Sf7#
    2.Sd2+? C Ke3! a
    2.Sb2+? A Ke5! b

There is an ordinary 3x2 Zagoruiko after 2...Ke3,Ke5 and something like this is certainly thematic for this tourney. However, the second-move tries and refutations form the "cyclic Ruchlis" pattern, which was my main intention (the Zagoruiko was just a welcome consequence). Moreover, there is a well ordered complete 3x3 cycle or, to use the term I proposed in 1996 for a complete cycle, a "cyclone". (Alas it was later used as a title for a collection of cyclic problems; I suggested the author in due time a better name for the book - "Cyclopedia" - which he unfortunately rejected... but that's another story).
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(6) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 19:43]

It is interesting that all points made so far in this thread are aimed at cyclic twomover themes. There are other typical twomover themes that might be extended further. Hm. For me this is perhaps the most interesting tourney announced for 2010 so far (except Leo tourney, of course) and I will try to do my best in the fairy section. Excellent theme for TT, congratulations.
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(7) Posted by Frank Richter [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 21:21]

Why is the number of variations a criterion for the quality of a problem?
It is better to see one or two good and deep variations than a lot of uninteresting play.
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(8) Posted by Miodrag Mladenović [Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009 22:05]; edited by Miodrag Mladenović [09-12-29]

Frank wrote:
Why is the number of variations a criterion for the quality of a problem?

There is no rule about this. It's just my personal taste. I may not express myself very well. I did not count variatios itself. But i do prefer #3 showing three variations than to see same variations as three phases in twomover (two tries + solution). However it does not mean that I would automatically place down good problem showing some complex theme hard to achieve (like for exampe Ukrainian cycle). However I know lot of problemists that will not like twomover showing one variation in each phase.

Also, in my opinion it's harder to compose #3 that incorporates three twomover phases than to compose twomover with twins. It's not ease to compose #3 that is actually showing three twomovers in three different variations.

Once again this is just my personal opinion and you did raise a very good question.

Frank wrote:
It is better to see one or two good and deep variations than a lot of uninteresting play.

Of course that it's better to see one or two good and deep variatons than a lot of uninterestng play. However my post was about showing same content from the twomover with a twins in a threemover. So let assume you see #3 showing three twomover variations or #2 with a same content but with some ugly twin changes. What would be your preference in that scenario?

Milan, this would be a good question for a pool. I noticed that there was not a pool question for a while. I did like your pools so I think it's time for some new questions. This may be a good candidate. I am wondering what other problemists are thinking about this issue.
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MatPlus.Net Forum Competitions Udo-Degener 50 JT