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MatPlus.Net Forum General World Association of Сhess Сomposition
 
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(1) Posted by Andrey Selivanov [Friday, Mar 27, 2009 15:02]

World Association of Сhess Сomposition


My offer of the new name of our organisation - World Association of Сhess Сomposition (WACC).
I wait for discussion.
 
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(2) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Friday, Mar 27, 2009 15:21]

Andrey, I guess, based on the discussion in the other thread, that you are not joking. The view of splitted chess composition world for me is sad and ridiculous at the same time. Is it really necessary to establish a new organization? There are so few chess composers and we should split...

If yes, anyway, I would suggest to start with mission and aims of the organization you envisage, not its name or its leading figures.
 
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(3) Posted by Vladimir Tyapkin [Friday, Mar 27, 2009 15:29]

I am not a native English speaker, but isn't 'association' means a group of people? 'Association of chess problemists' or 'Association of chess composers' makes sense while 'Association of Сhess Сomposition' does not sound correct. World Chess Composition Association would be better.

Also, isn't it too early to discuss the name?
 
 
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(4) Posted by Guy Sobrecases [Friday, Mar 27, 2009 15:44]

You are right, Vladimir, this name does not sound correct.

On top of that, the WACC is very well known by financial guys as the Weighted Average Cost Of Capital.

Less popular, but also very active is the World Association for Christian Communication. I am afraid that the first congress of the World Association of Сhess Сomposition could be the occasion of some confusion created by unexpected visitors...
 
   
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(5) Posted by Sarah Hornecker [Friday, Mar 27, 2009 16:04]

How about Societe International des Echecs artistique, Globale Federation Resoudret Internationale des Echecs et eitre Diplomande (SIEGFRIED).
(International Society of artistic chess, global federation of solving chess and for diplomacy of both).

Ok, just kidding! But the first part seems fine: Societe International des Echecs artistique


Best,
the name patron :-)
 
   
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(6) Posted by Steven Dowd [Monday, Mar 30, 2009 18:58]

I assume Association is used due to the FIDE association as well...

But yes, when Association is used it is as Guy noted, Association for, not Association of, usually.

Many bogus agencies use the term "World." I would stay away from it. What is wrong with the International Assocation for Chess Composition?
 
   
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(7) Posted by Guy Sobrecases [Monday, Mar 30, 2009 20:24]

I agree Steven, but I wonder if IACC could fit as this is already used by the International Anti Counterfeiting Coalition ("the world's largest non-profit organization devoted solely to protecting intellectual property and deterring counterfeiting"). Not a joke! :-)
 
   
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(8) Posted by Vladimir Tyapkin [Monday, Mar 30, 2009 20:49]; edited by Vladimir Tyapkin [09-03-30]

Well, googling for PCCC(http://www.google.com/search?q=PCCC&hl=en&start=0&sa=N) returns pages of organizations with the same name, with our PCCC being top result on the 5th(!) page.
 
 
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(9) Posted by Kevin Begley [Monday, Mar 30, 2009 23:47]; edited by Kevin Begley [09-03-31]

How about TAFKAP (The Association Formerly Known As Permanent)?

Seriously, we cannot be a world association of chess composition -- this name does imply two things:
1) a global band of chess problems have organized themselves, and
2) the Isardam problems have not yet taken control.

To borrow from Witney Houston, WACC is wack.

International Association of Chess Composers is also a failure, because this fails to represent all three main groups (Solvers, Composers and Enthusiasts -- as established in another thread).

The most economical term I can find would be: Problemists.
Unfortunately, the endgame study contingent may not agree with the use of "Problem" or "Problemist."

We could invent a new term: Chess Compositionists (creators of, solvers of, and fans of Chess Composition), to create:
International Chess Compositionists Association (ICCA) ?

But, this'll set ye back a few pints -- ICCA = Irish Correspondence Chess Assocation.
Sour Grapes lads -- the acronym sounds too much like "Wicca, minus the Witchcraft" anyway.

Besides, isn't Federation a better term to use -- if FIDE intends to recognize it as such, why not make use of this?
Just take PCCC's name, which was agreeable, and replace "Permananent Commision" with "International Federation" ?

International Federation for Chess Compositions (IFCC).
 
   
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(10) Posted by Dejan Glisić [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 00:45]; edited by Dejan Glisić [09-03-31]

The name is not crucial matter, but I was reading somewhere about World (or International) Chess Composition Federation (or World Federation of Chess Composers) which organized chess composition tourneys between World War I and World War II.
However, PCCC has to decide about the name and about our organization and activities in the future.
P.S. 'Association' sounds like associated individuals, while 'Federation' is better for associated national organizations. (!?)
 
   
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(11) Posted by Harry Fougiaxis [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 02:03]; edited by Harry Fougiaxis [09-03-31]

It may be only semantics, but I feel that Federation sounds "stronger" than Association and I bet it would be difficult to have the consent of the "big" Federation. Imho, it is better to avoid creating an issue without some particular reason. On top of that, there is the International Correspondence Chess Federation and an acronym such as the proposed IFCC, could easily be confused with their long-time established acronym ICCF. I like better the name International Association for Chess Compositions, as proposed by Steven.

Being a delegate in the (ex?)-PCCC myself, I guess I should add a necessary disclaimer here, that this is a proposed new name, and not the name of a proposed new organisation :)
 
   
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(12) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 04:06]; edited by Jacques Rotenberg [09-03-31]

Sorry Harry

PCCC is not ex yet
 
   
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(13) Posted by Harry Fougiaxis [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 07:50]; edited by Harry Fougiaxis [09-03-31]

Of course it is not, since only the body itself can decide so, but if we wish to continue being affiliated to FIDE, don't you agree that the commission should change its name and the statuses?

Edit: Nevertheless, I do understand that I may be misinterpreted here, so I changed to (ex?)
 
   
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(14) Posted by Andrey Selivanov [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 07:55]

New idee - IACCS - International Association Chess Composers and Solvers
 
   
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(15) Posted by Dejan Glisić [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 11:10]

Dear Andrey, :))
Maybe Kirsan can give us a name? :))
 
   
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(16) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 11:46]; edited by Jacques Rotenberg [09-03-31]

Everyone can appreciate this technical and professional note of A. Selivanov.

Why not to add solvers in the title ? (May I add "...and why not also 'lovers' in general of chess problems ?)

There is a reason in fact for these kind of notes , a very good one.

Voting rights.

All the time the membership of an association is hazy, you may have a nice fellow bringing 1 million mandates of 'chess lovers' or of 'solvers' even of unknown problemists. It is an open door for all kind of cheating.

If anybody forgot it, I think it is a good place to recall that A. Selivanov tried in previous PCCC votes to introduce mandates from countries unknown of PCCC because they have no known problemists there !!
 
 
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(17) Posted by Andrey Selivanov [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 12:22]

Dear Dejan!
This our right. It will be solved by delegates of the Congress. Kirsan often reads books on a chess composition and likes to solve chess problems. I think that there will be time when we will organise its participation in solving - show for composition popularisation.

Dear mr.Rotenberg!
Who the unknown person? Sergey Smotrov (Kazakhstan), Ilham Aliev (Azerbaijan). Albert Ivanov (Moldova) or composers of Armenia (Manveljan, Amirjan)? They do not participate in the congresses, but work for a composition much.
 
   
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(18) Posted by Dejan Glisić [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 13:45]; edited by Dejan Glisić [09-03-31]

Dear Andrey, of course it is our right to get the name for our organization. PCCC is still our organization, our elected deputies are members of PCCC, so I believe that PCCC should decide about the name. Of course, It will be ideal that we give some proposals.
You are FIDE special project advisor elected by Kirsan, and it is final, and I hope that you will obey PCCC decisions about our status. Than you can coordinate and contribute to next PCCC.
Kirsan solves chessproblems. He is the 'type 3' in Valery Gurov's 'nomenclature', and for now he is the 'type 6' in my sarcastic 'nomenclature of chesscomposers'. Is he going to participate some solving tourney and become recognized solver?
Last few years our organization had some troubles about Congresses. It was significant that something has to be changed! My opinion - maybe you were on the right way before Antalya. A great number of chesscomposers and solvers supported ECSC's because it was cheaper, 3 days long event for 6 solvers per country. In Antalya, ECSC became another expensive 7-day-long congress, and with restriction for internet composing tourney (this restriction was strike in my head). Junior Championship was destroyed. Did Turkish managers and hoteliers, who are not the part of our chesscomposing comunity, forced prices to earn some money from our community? Who decided about ECSC in Antalya? I can't find any official decision of PCCC, or decision of chess solving subcomitee. Turkish manager came to Jurmala to fight for another Congress. Is it because they didn't earn a money from ECSC? Or there are political reasons? He did not come to Jurmala because he is 'in love to our society'. Where are Turkish solvers and composers?
Which way our community goes? I am realy tired of the managers, functioners and chessplayers. Maybe the 'Promenade' is the best part of Forum for me, in this moment. Humor is a medicine! :))
 
   
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(19) Posted by Andrey Selivanov [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 14:01]

Dear Dejan!
Who has solved about the congress in Rhodes? I did not see this solution of РССС. In Moscow-open the prize fund of 5000 US dollars has been established. The winner Moscow опена to Georgy Evseyev was applauded by 1000 chess players. They saw the winner solving competitions. And someone from chess players becomes solver. Thanks to the competition name (World Solving Cup) at winners taxes did not levy from monetary prizes.
 
   
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(20) Posted by Dejan Glisić [Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 14:53]; edited by Dejan Glisić [09-03-31]

My congratulations about Moscow Open!
But I am sorry because Antalya wasn't that quality! The first ECSC in Legnica, Poland, was very good! God bless Piotr Murdzia. The second ECSC was not so good, but it was cheap and there were lot off solvers.
I agree about the Rhodos, it was clear that decision was fast because there was problem with organization in Bulgaria. However, I would like to see all of decisions in a future. Transparency is what we need! Only transparency can help us to build a strong and healthy international community.
Our independence is very important, especially independence of chess composers. Our population is small, there are much more chess players, or chess solvers in the future, and if we are not independent they could help to chessfunctioners and chess managers to be our bosses in the future. They could laugh to you when you show them 'Lachny cycle' or some ABC-themes, they can call you 'idiot' when you explain 'dual avoidance' or 'virtual play'. And when they pay a membership fee, they have the same rights as you. Then, they can tell you what is chess composition and how you have to compose. Maybe your chessplayers are excellent, maybe they understand modern themes and maybe they respect composers? In my country, there are two associations of 'problemchess' which can't organize chess composition or chess solving competitions without chess federation. It is very sad for art of chess composition!
 
   
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MatPlus.Net Forum General World Association of Сhess Сomposition