|(1) Posted by Aleksey Oganesjan [Wednesday, Jun 19, 2019 16:41]; edited by Aleksey Oganesjan [19-06-19]|
Quick Composing TT-227 (h#2) C. 01-08-2019
Editorial board of international web project "SuperProblem" (http://superproblem.ru/index-en.html) announces a quick composing thematic tourney for helpmates in two moves.
Awards will be published on the website http://superproblem.ru
View the announcement on the link http://superproblem.ucoz.ru/blog/2019-06-19-219#02
|(2) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Wednesday, Jun 19, 2019 19:28]|
Is the 2nd black move asked to be possible/present as potential 1st move ? (or can it appear only after 1st white move - or after black 1st move ) ?
|(3) Posted by Rajendiran Raju [Wednesday, Jun 19, 2019 19:34]|
it seems both pdf's links not working...
|(4) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Wednesday, Jun 19, 2019 21:22]; edited by Vitaly Medintsev [19-06-19]|
All three listed possibilities are allowed.
However B2 must be B2 in the actual play but not B1 :-)
|(5) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Wednesday, Jun 19, 2019 21:28]|
Both links are working now
Announcement in English - http://superproblem.ru/doc/ads/tt-227_announcement_eng.pdf
|(6) Posted by Marjan Kovačević [Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 00:45]|
Maybe the last part of this sentence needs some correction:
"W1 is motivated by overcoming the negative effect that occurs in the second white move (mating move) but not in the second black move."
Negative effect exists in B2 too, capturing of white guarding unit, but it is impure. If the mate would be something like 2.Bxc4# wouldn't W1 be thematic?
|(7) Posted by Rajendiran Raju [Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 03:02]|
|(8) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 07:26]; edited by Vitaly Medintsev [19-06-21]|
Formally, you are right - capturing of white guarding unit i.e. negative effect exists in B2 too (in exapmle 2 from the announcement). However, since W1 completely looses its thematic meaning by the reason I had explaned in the example 2, I think the mentioned negative effect in B2 looses its thematic meaning also.
And yes, if mate would be something like 2.Bxc4# (in exapmle 2 from the announcement) W1 would be thematic.
In the following scheme B1 & W1 are thematic:
(= 5+9 )
1.Bf3 Ba5 2.Sd8 b5#
|(9) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 14:25]|
so, if I understand well, this, for example, is thematic ?
Israel - Macedonia 2005 - 2006
version "Israeli Problem Art" 2012
(= 9+9 )
1.Sf7 Sg3 2.Q×g6 d3‡
1.Se6 Se3 2.Qe5 d4‡
another question related to this too :
As you can see, W2 also is an answer to a negative effect introduced by B2.
B2 controls 3 new lines (negative effects), one is closed by B1, one by W1 and one by W2. How do you consider this last effect ?
|(10) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 15:43]; edited by Vitaly Medintsev [19-06-20]|
Thanks for this educative example, Jacques.
Within the frame of SuperProblem TT-227, I tend to consider this problem to be non-thematic and here is why.
In the formulation of the tourney theme we find the following: 'the second Black's move (B2) has two negative effects...' which I suppose means exactly two but not two or more negative effects.
In example given by you, B2 controls 3 new lines as you wrote. So B2 has 3 negative effects. Even if we speak in terms of tactical content of the effects we can recognize three different types of negative effect of B2 in the first solution - 2.Qxg6: 1) direct check to WK, 2) taking control over static mating unit - Rg2 and 3) taking control over mating line (square c2 on the line a2-h2).
Regarding to effect that occurs in W2, I also consider it non-thematic since it happens after B2 and thus it can not be anticipatory - this does not match the tourney name as well as the main concept of the tourney theme.
W2 can not be thematic or non-thematic since W2 is out of thematic content of SuperProblem TT-227.
|(11) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Friday, Jun 21, 2019 00:04]|
Thank you for your extensive answer Vitaly
"...The second Black's move (B2) has two negative effects, for instance a check to white king and a
capture of a needed white unit (see example 1). One of the negative effects needs to be overcome
(neutralized) in the first Black move (B1), and the other – in the first White move (W1). At least two phases with
given theme condition (in multisolution form or twins) are required. ..."
The word "anticipation" you are right is (only) in the title.
Anyhow, it is clearly your intention so W2 is not thematic.
what is more questionable is your 'clarification'
"... 'the second Black's move (B2) has two negative effects...' which I suppose means exactly two but not two or more negative effects..."
it is a total surprise to me and also it seems to bring useless difficult new questions, and I don't exactly understand why you feel necessary to write this
|(12) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Friday, Jun 21, 2019 07:29]; edited by Vitaly Medintsev [19-06-21]|
I feel necessary to write about exactly two but not two or more negative effects because B2 in your h#2 has three negative effects and thus is non-thematic only by this arithmetic reason : 3 is not 2 which are required in the tourney theme.
In my view, the word 'anticipation' in the tourney title satisfies the theme condition since B1 & W1 are anticipatory avoidance/prevention/compensation of two negative effects occur in B2
|(13) Posted by Jacques Rotenberg [Friday, Jun 21, 2019 11:20]|
in such a case what do you say ?
(= 6+11 )
1.Rb5 Sb3 2.e5 Bd8‡
2.e5 would give check, and a flight on b5 and a flight on c5 - all in all 3 negative effects
|(14) Posted by Vitaly Medintsev [Friday, Jun 21, 2019 11:52]; edited by Vitaly Medintsev [19-06-21]|
I find this case thematic since I've counted two negative effects in B2: 1) discovered check to WK and 2) line-closure of white unit that guards flights.
I think the quantity of guarded squares next to BK does not matter but the types of negative effects does!
Sorry, I was wrong!
This case is non-thematic since Sb3 overcomes both negative effects while theme condition allows only one.
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